Loading ...I slump into my seat at exactly 3:55. I’m always 5 minutes early for everything. I can’t stand being late. I cannot tolerate the idea that someone out there wasted […]
Original post: When to See a Therapist
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I think the entire point of the shrink, however, is essentially to make you hold things up to your face… figuratively speaking, of course.
I think a lot of being a shrink is getting people to really face their issues, own up to them, cope with them instead of avoiding them.
People are GREAT at building up defense mechanisms, ways of avoiding things, putting on a brave face. How often do we run across people that can deal with us in a completely raw way?
Say what you want, somebody that can do that for you, whether it’s a really good friend or a shrink, is truly valuable.
The phenomenon V describes to her therapist is called sleep paralysis.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_paralysis
I’ve known a few people who experience this (or used to, as children) but have never been able to name it, so I’m just pointing this out for anyone out there who want to do some reading about it.
Ummm… I think the phenomenon V describes is her mother drunk, sitting on her, and attempting to suffocate her.
At the risk of monopolizing this comment thread…
Whether V’s experience was real or imagined I suppose is debatable. The difficulty is, once you start questioning the reality of stories such as this, the reality of any of V’s stories comes into question.
It is rather believable within the context of earlier stories that V’s mother would have attempted something like this when she was drunk. Additionally, the psychiatrist’s question concerning whether V thought she would believe the story points to a real situation over a fantasy.
I suppose you could also claim that the trauma that led to her current phobia could be the result of her general fear of her mother, the belief that she was capable of such an act, combined with a shocking hallucination… I’m just not certain I buy that as traumatic enough to create such a specific life-long phobia.
Interesting story there V. I think keronian’s point is quite correct that the shrink’s whole job is to help resolve those issues by bringing them to the surface where they can be processed. When things are deep in the back of the mind they aren’t being dealt with, they are being buried, but they still need to be dealt with and they act up with panic attacks and other irrational behavior until they are dealt with.
V, you maybe could use a good hypnotist more than you have need of a therapist. I often have clients that have been in therapy for years and years make near-instant progress by coming to me, shocking their therapists silly in the process.
If you’re interested, I’d recommend a hypnotist of the McFall school of thought. It’s just as easy to find an ineffective hypnotist as it is to find an ineffective therapist, and this methodology really seems to help a great deal, very quickly and completely.
I’ve helped people from similar situations (wildly abusive childhoods) as yours a great deal, and I’d be happy to help if you like. Email me if you’re so inclined…
Jeremy
“People are GREAT at building up defense mechanisms, ways of avoiding things, putting on a brave face. How often do we run across people that can deal with us in a completely raw way?”
-keronian
A question: who is the “us” ? And what, to you, is raw interaction? Is it good?
This makes me think of clothes. Clothes are a cultural invention. The people who live in the types of habitats where humans have always lived don’t wear much. They don’t need to. But they still have loincloths. What difference does a bit of underwear make?
Would you rather everyone walk around naked? I wouldn’t mind- there are some hot people I’d like to study further, and some really f-ugly folks I confess a morbid curiosity about.
The way you talk about “defense mechanisms” you’d think they were a bad thing. Let’s talk about clothes again. Would the eskimos be better people if they walked around naked, open to the world, proud of the skin they’re in?
No. They’d be dead. Because it’s freaking cold up north. The defense mechanism, the social construct of heavy clothing keeps them alive.
The only thing that’s good about constantly making someone cry is that you break down their old defense mechanisms, allowing them to develop new ones more appropriate to their new environment. It’s kind of like teaching an eskimo to be comfortable in a loincloth when he visits the equator, because otherwise he could get heat exhaustion.
But you do need some sort of new adaption. I guess I agree with V- just crying gets you no where.
I want to hunt your mother down and beat her to death and because I’m one of those previously abused kids who find it easier to defend someone else than themselves, you can do my dad.
This is interesting to read, as a college student working towards becoming a therapist, and currently working in the mental health system. I say interesting, because as I see it, the therapist is doing things that are both good and bad, and you, V, are also doing things that are both good and bad.
The good from the therapist? She’s trying to get you to open up. A therapist cannot help without knowing what’s going on. Much as you might want to bury your trauma, it is obviously manifesting itself in what seems to be unpleasant ways - I have yet to meet someone who enjoys panic attacks. On the other hand, a therapist should never push a client beyond what they are able to reveal. I phrase this oddly, because part of therapy is going beyond your comfort zone and bringing up parts of your past that you might not want to look at, but at the same one, the therapist shouldn’t push too hard, either. What is most important is a strong relationship between the therapist and the client, where both parties feel comfortable talking with each other. You, V, obviously don’t feel entirely comfortable with your therapist, and that’s something that *both* of you need to work on.
As for your part, you really do need to buy into to the therapy. While it may seem pointless now, some of that is because you aren’t putting the effort into it that’s needed for the therapist to make any kind of progress. You need to put the effort in to facing old emotions and old fears/traumas, and letting the therapist work with you to find better defense and coping mechanisms against those feelings. On the other hand, you seem to be doing a good job of recognizing when you aren’t truly able to work something out yet - now you just need to vocalize that more with your therapist. Try to get to the point where you feel that you can actually trust her with your emotions, rather than simply spilling your guts to a blank wall.
But, yes, you are right - crying is not therapeutic, in and of itself, and therapy is far more than just crying. But going beyond that takes work from both you and your therapist.
Without commenting on the therapy side, I must say the end was a bit of anti-climax. Long story but then a wee bit of non-sequitur and bang: The end.
She left me hanging there… “If you want a quiet place to cry, see a shrink.” … and? …and? Come on! That can’t be the sole moral of the story?
And the last bit “start holding [things] up in front of your face until you can finally learn to live with it.” …yes… sound advice, but how did we get into this conclusion? Is there a piece missing? What I’ve learned from American movies, at least a 7-year therapy piece missing? (Yep, movies… I don’t know many people in therapy in Europe. And the couple of friends that I know have been to therapy because of burn-out were there for couple of months, so don’t know how much time therapists need in the America.)
@Sami: Considering how personal this post was, maybe for once (or twice, or thrice, etc.) she wrote it for herself, and not for her audience. Or YOU.
I get anxiety attacks when blankets are put over my head too - I can’t snuggle into anyone with my face. I get uncomfortable watching people on TV get into enclosed spaces - like I can’t breath.
It’s pure association. Takes you right back. A therapist can help you make the connection, make you feel less weird about it, maybe this will allow you to cope but I don’t think the feeling ever goes away.
I can’t stand my ankles being touched either - I totally freak. There’s one I don’t understand at all.
But she is *my* dancing monkey?
She writes an on-line internet all-public blog, rite?
Internet! Entertain me!
I agree with V. All war stories should be funny. Yes, you can always find a funny spin on the most fucked up shit. If you can’t find the humor, then you keep your damn mouth shut. At least that what I do.
Yeah, this story is real. Very real. This was not a sleep induced nightmarish hallucination. This was not sleep paralysis. Her drunk mother took pillow and smothered her. More than once.
There are two realities. One reality is where people are cruel and try to destroy you, either quickly or slowly. The other reality is the “normal” world. In the normal world people are polite and cordial. When you are jacked up on adrenelin and hypervigilant, which world is going to seem more real? If you live with evil and cruelty everyday then the “normal world” seems a quaint fantasy. If you escape the cruelty, (without wearing a wrap-around jacket strung out on thorazine) then you learn to live in the normal world. The normal’s don’t want to hear about the other world. Unless it is filtered through the 11 o’clock news or a made for TV drama. So you have to fake being normal.
As for crying… I have one hard and fast rule: Never cry in front of an adversary, potential or actual. Avoid crying in front of those who are also depending on you. I cry. But rarely in front of others. V’s mother killed an innocent child. Yes, V survived but the innocence was bruttally smothered. I would give tears up for that loss. Does it do any good? Who cares. Do it anyway.
When V waits for the shrink to speak first, she is taking an adversarial stance with the shrink. Kinda like a staring contest or gunslingers waiting to see who draws first at high noon. The shrink knows this and uses this game to see if V is resistant or not. Hey V, if you want to have some fun, show up five minutes late, make a quick apology and then launch in monologue about what ever strikes your fancy. The shrink’s reaction to the abrupt change of script might be amusing. Don’t worry the shrink will steer the conversation back to what she wants to explore.
One final note, I would love to be sitting next to V on plane and the breathing masks accidentally deploy. That would be some funny shit!
-From the Ravings of the Psychomancer
MonkWren– Your “buy-in” to therapy is both idealistic and naïve and as expected of a studying therapist, your response is textbook correct but lacks perspective. I’m guessing you work the evening swing shift at an RTC and have been there for less than a year? The reality is that most therapists DO use tears as a measure of success. Therapy has very few tangible measures of success, and since most therapists are in the field to resolve their own issues, they crave success and crying becomes their vindication. Is the traditional “therapeutic process” really healthy and effective considering that even those who propagate it (therapists), use the “talk” and “questions” as punchlines when they hang out socially?
The value of therapy is simply providing an emotionally safe environment and it’s just another escape and coping method. For some an office and a stranger is the only place they have that.
Sami—Actually, she is MY dancing monkey.
Having been to a shrink for similar family issues, I can say I was highly disappointed with the experiences. I guess though that my main problem was that I wasn’t sure exactly what the issues I needed to work through were, especially because it wasn’t my idea to go in the first place.
I found it highly humiliating to have to pay to talk to someone; that’s what I have friends and the internet for. My particular shrink didn’t give me all that practical advice or feedback either, and I think what I really craved was some feedback. Anyways, when I didn’t feel that I was getting anything positive out of it, I stopped going. Really, the only issues I have are with the person who suggested I go, and the shrink pretty much agreed with me that they really needed to work through their own issues instead of trying to “fix” others around them.
V is seeing the wrong kind of therapist (for what she wants) and should seek a referral to one from the Cognitive Behavioral branch.
This therapist is good at drawing out the emotion, but V already said she talks about the story anyways (even if in a self protective way.) The problem that is interfering with her life, and what she wants to solve, is the resulting panic attacks. While dealing with the past issues as a way to maybe help handle the current symptoms is one direction to attack it from, the reverse can also be used (deal with the symptoms so she can reevaluate the past issues without the context of continued problems bugging her.)
The best approach is, of course, to go at it from both directions.
There are a lot of active behavioral therapies that can help a person overcome panic attacks and related issues. If her current therapist isn’t providing her with those services, she should seek out one who will (a cog/behavioral therapist.)
I don’t know if she reads these comments, but it’d be a good idea to seek one out, or, since she has a stubborn independent streak, buy an Abnormal Psych textbook/read online the processes used to deal with them.
Holly crap! My first reaction to the story was “wtf!” Looks like the first reaction of a lot of other people are totally different…
pablo - You are correct in that I’ve worked at the house less than a year, although I’ve worked both morning and evening shifts, and my “buy-in” to therapy may be naive and idealistic - but if we don’t maintain some of that idealism, what’s the point? You are correct that there are few tangible or immediately visible effects to therapy, but tears are not an automatic indicator that progress is being made - all they indicate is that the person is going through emotional pain, frequently because they are reliving past pain. The point of therapy is to move beyond the tears to the processing that happens afterwards, but sometimes the tears are necessary to be able to process. Tears in and of themselves, however, are not indicative of the ability to process, nor do they indicate progress in therapy, even if they are used as such. The point of therapy is to use a safe and comfortable environment to address past or present issues, and to help the client overcome those issues. Simply airing the issues out like old laundry is not all there is to therapy, however.
As for the idea of a “traditional” therapeutic process, I have yet to meet a therapist that uses one approach exclusively, although they may specialize in one area or another. Sean has a great idea in suggesting that V seek a Cognitive Behavioral specialist, given that V is apparently comfortable with her past (at least to the point where she can live with it, and enjoy life), and merely wants to be rid of some of the annoying side effects of those traumatic memories. That doesn’t mean that V’s current therapist cannot help, it’s merely an alternative.
My thoughts on therapy. Let me share them with you.
my god, V, your readers are all stupid.
they keep arguing about whether your stories are true or not.
they keep arguing about semantic things where if anyone took the time to LOOK UP the words, they’d know the answer.
and now they’re agruing about whether shrinks are good or bad without addressing any real issues!
look, V, here’s the answer.
therapists can be good or bad. most are bad.
therapists start out with an idealistic view of wanting to help everyone, but quickly get crushed (either in the job or in college), and turn into monsters who try to manipulate their patients. manipulation wil ALWAYS compound problems.
crying is the most efficient way of getting rid of bad feelings that are built up.
bad feelings build up. once you’re done crying, you have to get rid of the cause of the bad feelings, so that they stop building up.
people are excellent at creating defence mechanisms. in your case, V, the defense mechanism is simple mental disassociation. you turn the bad things into a funny story, so that YOU can laugh at them too. that is why crying about them is necessary for you.
but when you’re done crying, you need to fix the problems. that’s when you hold things in front of your face until you can stop the fear. that’s when you stop caring about how your mother tortured you as a young child, accept it, and then forgive it.
then once you’re done coping with all of that, you need to forgive yourself for having the fear.
put simply, crying is only one step. forcing away the fear is only another step. both of those steps have suitable replacements.
*ponder*
Epigeios makes an excellent point.
Crying can almost be seen as a little checkbox. Did you finally FACE what you’ve been hiding from yourself? Check. It made you cry. You experienced the situation again and realized how incredibly fucked up and WRONG it was, and that made you cry.
Now its time to take that knowledge and use it. If your therapist keeps harping on the crying thing like it’s the end of the road, she’s stuck. Sounds like she was a great start but it’s time to move on to a new therapist or whatever you need for this stage.
//My mom used to do the same thing, oddly enough. She only felt she “reached me” when she made me cry. I guess she should have become a therapist!
Wow. So, yeah, I reread that - she’s talking about her mom, not sleep paralysis. Jesus Christ.
..”.and since most therapists are in the field to resolve their own issues, they crave success and crying becomes their vindication.”
I don’t know which therapists you’ve been to, Pablo, but if one chooses to become a psychoanalyst, one must undergo several years of therapy themselves to assure that their own issues are already resolved before opening themselves up to other people’s issues and the possibility of their own issues interfering.
I personally adore my “therapist.” The second I step into his office, I feel more calm and peaceful. If you’re paying this person, THAT’S what you want to feel in therapy, not redundancy or fear.
Wow, this post was popular. Personally, I’d like to hear the funny version of that story.
So, you adapted and got over it, and you’re totally fine except for the panic attacks when you’re getting dressed?
Okay, I’m convinced. You don’t need therapy at all.
Jesus. Go find another therapist if you don’t think this one is working, but don’t sit there acting like you’re too good to need one.
Right fucking on. Therapists want nothing more than to have you sob for an hour a week (or more than that if you’re really stupid) and gratefully utilize the conveniently located tissues. If you can talk about your problems intelligently and coherently, a therapist will stop you. They have no interest in *discussing* your phobias or your anorexia or why you hate your parents. If you ever think you’re having a productive conversation with a therapist, it’s just because they’re still gathering information on how to turn on the water works in twelve words or less.
Rent “Old Yeller”. It’s cheaper and ultimately less damaging.
I had a psych teacher who said, “If you want to help people, don’t become a therapist. Become a lawyer.”
Just throwing that in there. Heh.